If you know how to use people they can be amazing, at least thats what I think.

That is not what we are debating here, sorry.

i think you need a fresher source. those posts were made before the english game was even out.

Why does it matter if its the English game or not? As I already stated, the basis of the posts were made after 3 days of detailed study of the game, and they're continueing to be edited as new techniques are found.

This happens in every game that has a competetive multiplayer community and includes many different types of characters. MMOs (WoW specifically), other fighters, even a few shooters out there have unbalanced gameplay thanks to certain characters being better than others. Its nothing new to see unbalenced gameplay in games.

I think that Brawl is as unbalanced as Melee, it just has more characters to fill the tiers.

he said impressions. maybe these guys just plain sucked balls with yoshi and i sure wouldnt expect them to be all that great with any of the 35 chars when asked on the spot.

oh yea...id like to know when hes spent 80 hours on EVERY SINGLE CHAR.

You're going to find something wrong with it if thats what you're looking for. You're convincing yourself rather than looking at the evidence with an open mind.

Don't worry, I disagreed with them once as well. But as I continued playing I realized that this is by far the most in-depth response I've ever seen, and it is exactly right. And don't try to diminish facts, it was a team of people, not some kid that mains Fox and hates Yoshi's guts.

I don't even know why I'm having this debate, I'm done with the tier list thing, you can believe whatever you want.

Who???

whoa. are you guys talking about a game? or analyzing a piece of literature? im sorry. giving a score to how powerful a character is in a video game is absolutely ridiculous. it isnt at all about all of the characters being balanced or unbalanced. its all about personal preference. i mean really. it seems like the way you want the game is for all of the characters to execute the exact same moves with the exact same amount of strength. but that would make for a boring game. the fact that the characters do have different moves is ALWAYS going to illicit the debate of which is better than which, when it doesnt necessarily exist. i can GUARANTEE that as the game is being developed the creators arent thinking of making one guy better than another. they see a character. develop a move set. and leave it at that. as long as theres differences in games. there will be debate over what is the best way to play. and the answer to that question is however you see fit. so quit crying about a VIDEO GAME. and do like i do. pick random at the character select screen. and have fun. its what the game was made for. not for people to analyze it. for people to have fun

i have read those before....

a)i'm not marioman
b) only people who main yoshi can really judge yoshi, because he has a unique play style to him, and unless you know everything about that playstyle, you can't know if he's good or not. look at the yoshi section of smashboards, they're all praising his buffs, some even questioning if he's high tier

i'd trust those people way more

Well the game is still unblanced i mean no matter how you look at it there is always going to be an unbalnce in a SSB game unless they all get the same moves in different skins, The thing is the best yoshi could NOT beat the best fox or marth because fox and marth are "bettter" than yoshi becuase how they were made.

Personally i main Olimar and Snake and both of them have a steep learning curve but are probably top tier if you learn to use them well

I feel the same way, and also that no characters moves are based around "advanced tecs" ...the players themself use the glitches that were overlooked in oreder to make the attack quicker etc...so if you can't use them as well without said tec then you've obviously become too over dependant on them.

Either way, I don't give a damn about tiers, I found characters that I enjoy going and not "tier list" will sway me.

stop saying that like it's fact, i believe the best yoshi could beat a best marth, but it's unlikely since hardly anyone mains yoshi, so the odds of a better player are against him

i believe the game to be very balanced, sure there are bad matchups(mario can't fight metaknight) but i think in general all characters are equal

Tier exists if you wanna compare X amount of good points in a character versus Y amount of good points in another. Even if every character had no lag in their moves, etc. then there'd be a tier of how strong attack are and things will still be "unfair".

Why is it unfair exactly? Because you can not win with the character you like? certainly you can't mean to tell me -everyone- is able to beat you simply because your character is of lower tier? Or is it because you can't win as much as you would like? If you're in the game for winning then don't worry about what character you like but what you have to use to win.

Top tier will dominate the tournament scene probably but that's because everyone wants to be a winner. This will be true for most game and shouldn't be something to bother people so much. Imagine what happen if your favorite character was top tier and everybody started using him/her, what will his/her value be worth to you?

What I'm saying is that no matter how balance the game gets people will nitpick who's faster than who down to the miliseconds and there would be an outcry of "unbalance" in that. It's just something to get used to. I'm sure with enough training with good people you will be able to punish most player well. Don't go off in the tangent saying "but if someone with the same amount of skill as me uses a higher tier then I'll be beaten." So what? You win some, you lose some. If you want to win much much more than losing without trying much then play with top tiers.

I see that you're trying to say because excluding certain ATs from previous games some character gets way more nerf than others, which I trust you in. I still believe that it's just a new strategy or play style that needs to be develop to conpensate that lost on certain character. If you can't recover fast from air born moves then you have to make sure you hit your opponent more often then? allowing you time to recover (if they get knock back far enough). If they shield and block a lot you just have to learn when the correct time is to do those moves, catch them off guard. I know it's all easier said than done, but if it is as easy said as done then there wouldn't be any fun would it?

i read that list to. its highly opinionated but good nonetheless