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  1. #101
    Sam I Am Boethiah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skippy View Post
    Most religious people would say that they do have evidence for their belief. Sure, you can't run some lab experiment to prove God or any particular religion, but evidence can take many forms.
    They're confusing knowledge with faith.

  2. #102
    Banned Twilight Hero's Avatar
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    I thought AndThen said knowledge comes in different forms.

  3. #103
    Sam I Am Boethiah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Twilight Hero View Post
    I thought AndThen said knowledge comes in different forms.
    Well, there is the science of knowledge, and the philosophy of knowledge. Calling faith knowledge is ridiculous.

  4. #104
    Banned Twilight Hero's Avatar
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    Well, if a religious person prays for a sick person and the person gets healed, they might say that they have evidence. They had faith that the person would be healed, but after the healing, they could say they have evidence. That's all I'm saying.

  5. #105
    ミュージック Gikoku Harakami's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by navarre View Post
    The same rule applies for most historical figures. There's no evidence except historical records that claims that Caesar conquered an empire, so why should doubt be cast over Jesus' existence and foundation of a religion without any disbelief regarding Caesar's achievements? I'm talking about irregardless of whether or not Jesus comitted miracles, he certainly created a massive impact on the world at that time.
    I'm not saying Jesus never existed, since I wouldn't be surprised if a man named Jesus did exist at that time while fitting the description, believing he was the son of God (similar to the Holy messengers you see floating around these days, claiming to have seen God and performing impossible miracles), when he probably wasn't.

    Quote Originally Posted by Twilight Hero
    Well, if a religious person prays for a sick person and the person gets healed, they might say that they have evidence. They had faith that the person would be healed, but after the healing, they could say they have evidence. That's all I'm saying.
    Not much of evidence when someone is able to provide a much more logical explanation for her healing. A lady gets a zit on her face, and she then begins to pray for it to go away... eventually it does (naturally), causing her to now claim evidence that there is a God because her zit eventually disappeared after she prayed. Really, I wouldn't be surprised if this was the explanation for Jesus' healing miracles..

    Point being... Faith is not Knowledge. Faith is what one wishes to be true, feelings that distort a reality, while knowledge shows what is actually real.

    One will have faith in God that their sick mother will heal if they perform good deeds, and obey their parents.. When in reality, the sick mother will just get better after taking her medication and getting much needed rest.
    Last edited by Gikoku Harakami; 03-02-2009 at 10:25 PM.

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  6. #106
    WiiChat Member rukus's Avatar
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    Point being... Faith is not Knowledge. Faith is what one wishes to be true, feelings that distort a reality, while knowledge shows what is actually real.
    no, faith is believing in what cannot be proven. theism and atheism are both believed upon faith. even faith can be brought toward knowledge. every time you sit down on a chair, you have faith that it will support you. if you open a fresh bottle of milk, you have faith that it will not be sour. faith does not only represent supernatural belief or knowledge.
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  7. #107
    WiiChat Member TheOneSpam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rukus View Post
    no, faith is believing in what cannot be proven. theism and atheism are both believed upon faith. even faith can be brought toward knowledge. every time you sit down on a chair, you have faith that it will support you. if you open a fresh bottle of milk, you have faith that it will not be sour. faith does not only represent supernatural belief or knowledge.
    That seems REALLY foolish to me.

    I do not have faith that the chair will not collapse. I have the knowledge that I'm not a fat ass, and I have the knowledge of the past 10000s of times I sat on it and it did not break. Historical, empirical, measurable, tangible evidence.

    And even the first time I sat on it, it was a test to make sure it functioned as the chair that the chair is claiming to be. =\
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  8. #108
    ミュージック Gikoku Harakami's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rukus
    no, faith is believing in what cannot be proven.
    Strong belief in something, without logical proof.. that deep down, some wish/hope to be true.

    Quote Originally Posted by rukus View Post
    theism and atheism are both believed upon faith. even faith can be brought toward knowledge. every time you sit down on a chair, you have faith that it will support you. if you open a fresh bottle of milk, you have faith that it will not be sour. faith does not only represent supernatural belief or knowledge.
    You're serious? ..

    I have knowledge that if I sit down on a weakened chair, that it will likely break if I'm too heavy and thus not support me. I would not blindly believe that a chair would support me, simply because I have faith that it will (no matter what).
    Last edited by Gikoku Harakami; 03-02-2009 at 11:35 PM.

    Gikoku ハラカミ
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    It's like a finger pointing to the moon.
    Don't concentrate on the finger or you'll miss all that heavenly glory.
    ~Bruce Lee, Wing Chun.


  9. #109
    WiiChat Member Eva's Avatar
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    Wow i shouldn't of even posted this.

  10. #110
    ミュージック Gikoku Harakami's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eva View Post
    Wow i shouldn't of even posted this.
    ... Why? No one is fighting.
    Last edited by Gikoku Harakami; 03-03-2009 at 12:23 AM.

    Gikoku ハラカミ
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    --------------------------
    Don't think. Feel...
    It's like a finger pointing to the moon.
    Don't concentrate on the finger or you'll miss all that heavenly glory.
    ~Bruce Lee, Wing Chun.


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