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  1. #21
    WiiChat Member SSBBdude's Avatar
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    To make this more than items, post your 5 main characters and 2 favorite stages.
    1. Ike
    2. Wolf
    3. Lucario
    4. Meta Knight
    5. Toon Link and my stages are Final Destination and The Summit
    Wiichat, dead.

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  3. #22
    An Instant Classic LevesqueIsKing's Avatar
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    ^Come on, man. Spoiler tags?

    Quote Originally Posted by COLDshiver
    Items will never be used in big tourneys (well maybe special ones, but not in real competitive ones) simply because it's based on luck and less skill. Like say someone was at 50% and the other at 150%. A hammer pops up and the 150% picks it up and wins a match. The 50% guy had no chance. With no items, it will be purely based on skill.
    First of all, you are misjudging tournaments. Tournaments that refuse to use items are usually doing so because of the 'random explosions' of the boxes and barrels. Many major tournaments have stated that they would be open to using items if such explosions could be turned off. After seeing that, in Brawl, these boxes and barrels are marked with signs, it should be interesting to see how tournaments react.

    Having pointed out this fallacy, your argument no longer holds depth. What happens if a guy grabs a hammer, you ask?

    You dodge him.

    I'm sorry, is that too logical of an answer for you? And to go more in-depth in my response, you should probably learn to be quicker and grab the next one that drops.

    Not to fit a mold,

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    Not to follow a crowd


  4. #23
    WiiChat Member SSBBdude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LevesqueIsKing
    ^Come on, man. Spoiler tags?


    First of all, you are misjudging tournaments. Tournaments that refuse to use items are usually doing so because of the 'random explosions' of the boxes and barrels. Many major tournaments have stated that they would be open to using items if such explosions could be turned off. After seeing that, in Brawl, these boxes and barrels are marked with signs, it should be interesting to see how tournaments react.

    Having pointed out this fallacy, your argument no longer holds depth. What happens if a guy grabs a hammer, you ask?

    You dodge him.

    I'm sorry, is that too logical of an answer for you? And to go more in-depth in my response, you should probably learn to be quicker and grab the next one that drops.
    LOL I couldn't have said it better. When items were put into brawl, they were meant to be used not turned off. Most people that don't use items don't use them because they either can't use them or can't make a strategy with them on because they're not smart enough.
    Wiichat, dead.

  5. #24
    WiiChat Member Douten's Avatar
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    Items tests your skills : )
    If you're not fast enough to get it than you better know how to block. Even hammer is dodge able. And not all the time does a hammer work.

  6. #25
    WiiChat Member SSBBdude's Avatar
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    I always die when I get a hammer
    Wiichat, dead.

  7. #26
    WiiChat Member spiff-ssbb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LevesqueIsKing
    But man iz ony fare if u plai no itmes and only final dsenation! Oderwise it lukc!
    i half agree. items on adds a random aspect to the game so i almost always play items off. but not ALL stages create random play. the ones used in major tourneys are safe. FD is the best though for 1v1 head to head skill competition in my opinion though
    "YOUR A HOOKER!" -Grandma's Boy

  8. #27
    WiiChat Member iggypop's Avatar
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    having items on makes the game fairer/funner for everyone. like reggie said about mario kart "a newcomer or a kart veteran will be able to compete bumper to bumper" ... having items on in brawl will always give the newbies a chance to beat the weiners who play for 12 hours a day and are able to come up with cheap little moves to win everytime (e.g. MSC) .... think about it, there will be a hell lot less disconnecters, if even the worst brawl player still has a chance to win by getting a great item against guys (or girls) who play this game non-stop ... a little luck goes a long way in making this game funner for everyone involved ....

  9. #28
    Wii Owner COLDshiver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LevesqueIsKing
    ^Come on, man. Spoiler tags?


    First of all, you are misjudging tournaments. Tournaments that refuse to use items are usually doing so because of the 'random explosions' of the boxes and barrels. Many major tournaments have stated that they would be open to using items if such explosions could be turned off. After seeing that, in Brawl, these boxes and barrels are marked with signs, it should be interesting to see how tournaments react.

    Having pointed out this fallacy, your argument no longer holds depth. What happens if a guy grabs a hammer, you ask?

    You dodge him.

    I'm sorry, is that too logical of an answer for you? And to go more in-depth in my response, you should probably learn to be quicker and grab the next one that drops.
    The hammer was just one example to illustrate my point. There are plenty of other reasons and different tourneys have their own reasons to restrict items and have their own set of rules. As you said,barrel explosions are one of them but yet luck is also a major reason. I guess my example was not good enough for you. I would like to see you dodge a hammer on final destination. Though big maps will not be a problem. I am not new to the ssb tourney scene either.

    I do not feel the need to go in depth since I was not arguing that items should be banned completely but rather at least gave a reason. Is it wrong to have a different viewpoint? And my example was from my experience with melee, not brawl. I've avoided as much spoilers as possible so I know very little about Brawl.

    The randomness of items adds a little bit of luck. And sometimes luck can screw up a good player. With the hammer, what happens if the hammer spawned right next to a player? The other player would have no chance to get it. And again, on small maps, how would you dodge it? If both players of of equal high skill, the hammer guy would have the upper hand and easily knock the other guy out. Easy to dodge? Not at a competitive level. If it were easy to dodge the guy, you were better than the other player from the start. How about fox getting a star? I would like to see you dodge a skilled player on any map.

    Is luck bad? No, but it starts to nibble away from being skill based. You can say it adds a bit of randomness and is great. Good for you, but some people don't see it that way. It's just like rocket launchers in Halo for example. If used wisely, you can rack up a ton of kills and used to your advantage but yet, a low level player can also spam rockets and get almost as much kills, if not the same or even more. So the rocket is a double edged sword.

    What's wrong with having no items? I use them and I have no problem with them. There's a reason on why there the option to disable them. If someone doesn't like items, their loss. If you like items, great! Don't like if it a tourney doesn't allow items? Then don't join it. Find another.

    But like you said, Brawl should be different. As with every new game, the game should be analyzed and tourney organizers will do whatever they feel makes the game competitive.

    EDIT: A clarification just in case, I don't hate items. I would like items to be used more often in tourneys but there are some cases that get you lucky kills, either for you or your opponent. I would like items in tourneys but there are some items that should not be allowed in tourneys, like hammers, stars, pokeballs, healing items, etc. ex. getting that big wolf/dog entei (sorry, not up to date with my pokemon) thing on final destination is just so unfair.
    Last edited by COLDshiver; 02-25-2008 at 07:40 PM.

  10. #29
    I really don't care. SkullKid's Avatar
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    Guys, c'mon, honestly. Brawl was meant to be a game with a different experience then your typical fighter. Do you see Goku flying around with a home-run bat, waiting for Vegeta to come just close enough so he can smash his face in? No, and you see, that's what makes brawl brawl. Brawl was made so gamers would have something that combines some of the greatest aspects of nintendo's games. Sakurai put items in for a reason. To be used! They are a good addition to this game, and anyone who choses to leave this addition out of the game is missing out on one of the most unpredictable elements needed in a nintendo game to make it a nintendo game. And no one's telling you to use items ALL THE TIME, because hardly anyone does. But if you ever get that feeling that your not getting the full experience of brawl, just switch items on. That's why they're there. To provide a thrilling, zany aspect to the game.


    Xbox Live Gamertag: Rocketman291
    Let me know if you wanna play Call of Duty: World at War or Halo 3.

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  11. #30
    An Instant Classic LevesqueIsKing's Avatar
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    COLDshiver

    I suppose we'll agree to disagree, then. To clarify, I like items because they add variability. When I played Melee, I also played Final Destination, no items for an extended period of time, and I found that after a while the game became boring. I'm going to do everything in my power to not let that happen in Brawl. Personally, I feel that even with items on, the better man will have a better record. He might not win every match he should, but he'll still be the better player in the grand scheme of things.

    Cheers for a civilized discussion.

    Not to fit a mold,

    Not to join a trend,

    Not to follow a crowd


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