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Thread: brawl character line up.

  1. #21
    WiiChat Member goldluigi's Avatar
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    I am not a fan of tiers I personaly just dont pay them mind.

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    WiiChat Member Red_Link's Avatar
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    I don't really like tiers either, I believe every character can be amazing. It depends on your skill, but also how you use that character.

  4. #23
    WiiChat Member goldluigi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red_Link View Post
    I don't really like tiers either, I believe every character can be amazing. It depends on your skill, but also how you use that character.

    my same feeling bro!

  5. #24
    The Scrubbiest of Hunters Splash_King's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red_Link View Post
    I don't really like tiers either, I believe every character can be amazing. It depends on your skill, but also how you use that character.
    Well, of course. Anyone who picks their character high off the tier list for the purpose of winning is a bigot. =P Skill is always the determining factor in who wins, both as a player in general via all-around ability, and how good you are with said character.

    But at the same time, Brawl's a surprisingly complex game. Tier lists do nothing but average out a character's "match-up potential", which is to say, how often on average they have an advantage when pitted a certain character. For example, Ganondorf doesn't have a single projectile and he's slow; that means most characters with a good projectile, or multiple useful ones (Samus, both Links, etc.), can easily manipulate Ganon into submission with said projectile(s). Since so few characters in the game don't have a good projectile, Ganon's often at a huge disadvantage since he's constantly running into characters he has trouble against. Thus, he's pathetically low on the tier list.

    On the other hand, someone like Snake who can rocket across the stage with his DACUS (if you don't know what that is, do ask), camp very easily with his multitude of useful projectiles and trap moves (his Down Smash mine, and Down B C4), as well as great recovery and powerful KO moves, means he has few problems against most weighty characters, speedy and light characters, or projectile-based characters. Since he can handle almost every character and often has advantages against plenty of characters, he's very high on the tier list. Essentially, tier lists are meant to show the potential a character has to be at an advantage/disadvantage on average, higher placement meaning they usually have advantages, lower placement meaning they are often at a disadvantage. No tier list can decide a match's outcome through this, basically.

    I could probably explain it simpler, but herpaderp for me. Hopefully you all get that.
    HomieG likes this.

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  6. #25
    Ur own personal Homeslice HomieG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SSBfreakCK View Post
    Well, of course. Anyone who picks their character high off the tier list for the purpose of winning is a bigot. =P Skill is always the determining factor in who wins, both as a player in general via all-around ability, and how good you are with said character.

    But at the same time, Brawl's a surprisingly complex game. Tier lists do nothing but average out a character's "match-up potential", which is to say, how often on average they have an advantage when pitted a certain character. For example, Ganondorf doesn't have a single projectile and he's slow; that means most characters with a good projectile, or multiple useful ones (Samus, both Links, etc.), can easily manipulate Ganon into submission with said projectile(s). Since so few characters in the game don't have a good projectile, Ganon's often at a huge disadvantage since he's constantly running into characters he has trouble against. Thus, he's pathetically low on the tier list.

    On the other hand, someone like Snake who can rocket across the stage with his DACUS (if you don't know what that is, do ask), camp very easily with his multitude of useful projectiles and trap moves (his Down Smash mine, and Down B C4), as well as great recovery and powerful KO moves, means he has few problems against most weighty characters, speedy and light characters, or projectile-based characters. Since he can handle almost every character and often has advantages against plenty of characters, he's very high on the tier list. Essentially, tier lists are meant to show the potential a character has to be at an advantage/disadvantage on average, higher placement meaning they usually have advantages, lower placement meaning they are often at a disadvantage. No tier list can decide a match's outcome through this, basically.

    I could probably explain it simpler, but herpaderp for me. Hopefully you all get that.
    Perfect explaination.

    Spoiler Alert!

  7. #26
    WiiChat Member goldluigi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SSBfreakCK View Post
    Well, of course. Anyone who picks their character high off the tier list for the purpose of winning is a bigot. =P Skill is always the determining factor in who wins, both as a player in general via all-around ability, and how good you are with said character.

    But at the same time, Brawl's a surprisingly complex game. Tier lists do nothing but average out a character's "match-up potential", which is to say, how often on average they have an advantage when pitted a certain character. For example, Ganondorf doesn't have a single projectile and he's slow; that means most characters with a good projectile, or multiple useful ones (Samus, both Links, etc.), can easily manipulate Ganon into submission with said projectile(s). Since so few characters in the game don't have a good projectile, Ganon's often at a huge disadvantage since he's constantly running into characters he has trouble against. Thus, he's pathetically low on the tier list.

    On the other hand, someone like Snake who can rocket across the stage with his DACUS (if you don't know what that is, do ask), camp very easily with his multitude of useful projectiles and trap moves (his Down Smash mine, and Down B C4), as well as great recovery and powerful KO moves, means he has few problems against most weighty characters, speedy and light characters, or projectile-based characters. Since he can handle almost every character and often has advantages against plenty of characters, he's very high on the tier list. Essentially, tier lists are meant to show the potential a character has to be at an advantage/disadvantage on average, higher placement meaning they usually have advantages, lower placement meaning they are often at a disadvantage. No tier list can decide a match's outcome through this, basically.

    I could probably explain it simpler, but herpaderp for me. Hopefully you all get that.



    now thats what im talking about!!

  8. #27
    God Doomsteady's Avatar
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    Heh... I remember when I had brawl. My friend would always use Ganon and wed be like, "Mike, he sucks, your NOT gonna win". But he stuck with it. A year later his Ganon is a force to be reckoned with. Goes to show that Tier list show so much. Id like to see Ganon get some buffs though. Maybe shorter neutral B attack time, bigger hit box, more original moves (hes still a falcon clone). Or if he has to be slow, give him normals that cancel out non charged or unchargable projectiles( make it slow though), give the guy a teleport, or a counter. His final smash is good (nearly impossible to doge with some characters). Give the guy some good mixups. ID main him then.

    Also: has ANYONE EVER met a good game & watch player? I havent.....

    Oh yeah, I know it was a glitch in melee, but BRING BACK WAVE DASHING. That was a tool that separate the good from the not so good in the tournament scenes and made things interesting. Unfortunately Smash isnt respected as a Fighting game by many and is simply dubbed a party game for kids.....

  9. #28
    The Scrubbiest of Hunters Splash_King's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doomsteady View Post
    (hes still a falcon clone)

    Also: has ANYONE EVER met a good game & watch player? I havent.....

    Oh yeah, I know it was a glitch in melee, but BRING BACK WAVE DASHING. That was a tool that separate the good from the not so good in the tournament scenes and made things interesting. Unfortunately Smash isnt respected as a Fighting game by many and is simply dubbed a party game for kids.....
    FALCON CLONE?! Does not compute. This isn't melee anymore; and even back then, he wasn't a clone. Similar looking moves =/= the same move. The only true, absolute clones were Roy and Marth in melee, and even then they still played drastically differently because of the tipper/center blade mechanics their attacks used (hence why Marth has been consistently high/top in Melee AND Brawl, while Roy was always Low).

    G&W is top tier, ya know. He's a lethal character, truly his own flaw being he's the second(?) lightest character in the game. Even then, his empty bucket can save him from nigh-any KO. If you don't know, whenever you bring out the bucket, all movement and knockback, including crazy-powerful knockback like Ike's Forward Smash, is 99% cancelled out. So long as you're quick enough, you can survive anything until you're like, at 200%. But even then, you'll still need a powerful move to throw him offscreen really quickly.

    And yeah, I've known only a few G&W mains, but they were scary-good. His playstyle is very unique, so it's impossible to pick 'em up and just be good. But his KO power, survivability (as described above =P), priority, recovery, and multitude of different useful and quirky moves make him insanely dangerous in the hands of a good player. Easily one of the best characters that isn't broken tier (Snake is still in debate about being broken... .-.).

    No, no wave dashing. It's not even a major tech anymore, few people seem to understand this unless they themselves are melee tournyists, lol. L-canceling and dash dancing are really the only techniques still used by every player from back in the day, and they're simply necesarry. Few characters get seriously good use out of WDing, like Luigi; or if you're a serious pro, multishines and the like. Wave dashing wouldn't work at all in Brawl's slow pace, and since SSB4 is going to get a mechanics overall like always, it probably wouldn't work there anyways, IMO.

    EDIT: Oh, and WDing is NOT a glitch. It's been stated time and again by Sakurai himself it was an intended mechanic of Melee. It did originate as a glitch, but they caught it early in development, and actually left it in as an advanced tech.
    Last edited by Splash_King; 07-27-2011 at 08:25 PM.

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  10. #29
    Ur own personal Homeslice HomieG's Avatar
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    i cant seem to control that down attack at all lol i should play online course ill probably suck havent played in ages

    Spoiler Alert!

  11. #30
    WiiChat Member goldluigi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SSBfreakCK View Post

    G&W is top tier, ya know. He's a lethal character, truly his own flaw being he's the second(?) lightest character in the game. Even then, his empty bucket can save him from nigh-any KO. If you don't know, whenever you bring out the bucket, all movement and knockback, including crazy-powerful knockback like Ike's Forward Smash, is 99% cancelled out. So long as you're quick enough, you can survive anything until you're like, at 200%. But even then, you'll still need a powerful move to throw him offscreen really quickly.

    And yeah, I've known only a few G&W mains, but they were scary-good. His playstyle is very unique, so it's impossible to pick 'em up and just be good. But his KO power, survivability (as described above =P), priority, recovery, and multitude of different useful and quirky moves make him insanely dangerous in the hands of a good player. Easily one of the best characters that isn't broken tier

    .




    YEAH G&W mains I see spam the down-air I get annoyed and the 9 hammer too! those are abused by n00bs and are far beyond cheap. there totally for n00bs abuse use catagory

    wacth out for magot spamers homieG.
    Last edited by Splash_King; 07-27-2011 at 08:50 PM.

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