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Thread: Super Smash Bros. 4

  1. #2851
    ♦ whata buncha jokers ♦ Neosquid's Avatar
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    I don't think entertainment value of a move should be completely ignored, though. Competitive viability obviously means something too but it's not the only thing that matters.




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  2. #2852
    Fall Mood Level 2 Mr. MR's Avatar
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    It's the only one that matters on the long run





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  3. #2853
    ♦ whata buncha jokers ♦ Neosquid's Avatar
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    If Jigglypuff loses Rollout I am going to have significantly less fun playing as her, that is certainly an aspect to consider. If the move that would replace Rollout is more competitively useful, that is also somefin to consider. You have to consider both. Personally I think Rollout is too fun of a move to simply get rid of because the competitive players don't use it. If it was a useless move that wasn't fun, like, oh, Lucario's Force Palm. I don't know if it's considered good or not, but for the sake of my point let's say it's useless. If it's useless and not fun to use, then there's no reason not to replace it next game. Rollout may be useless, but it's certainly a fun and interesting move, and I don't think that should be ignored.

    Believe it or not, some people get more satisfaction from having fun in a match than they get from winning (like me). The game should try to appeal to competitive and casual players.
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  4. #2854
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    I just spent 15 minutes reading all this back, even though I'm really busy. Damn I'm smart.

  5. #2855
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    Well I certainly hope you found my argument to have made some sense...




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  6. #2856
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    Haha yeah it certainly did make sense. I'd love to see them all specials except for sing and just buff sing. See what else they can do with her. Whatever they do, she'll probably become better than she was before, lol.

    I really hope the new Pikachu down-special is not too easy to avoid. Other then that, I really like the new change
    Last edited by Splash_King; 04-03-2014 at 07:06 AM.
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  7. #2857
    The Scrubbiest of Hunters Splash_King's Avatar
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    In the very first Smash 4 trailer (y'know, the one with all'a the Mega Man hype), Pikachu's Thunder looked pretty much the same. Might'a changed by now, but who knows. Probably not I reckon, since casuals love t' complain 'bout the move as is, even if it's a very niche move with few uses.

    Quote Originally Posted by Neosquid View Post
    I've found Rollout really useful but I mostly play against fellow casuals, so that doesn't necessarily mean a whole lot.
    It means nothing. Ike's fully-charged F-smash is good against casuals lol. Rollout is a terribad move, even against nubs, unless they've the brain of a fly and don't understand that you can just jump over the move. Its only usable application is a (gimmicky) ground-based punish solely for a 2v1 in Doubles, and sweet-spotting the ledge when recovering... which is always a really bad idea if an opponent is at the ledge, since they can just drop onto the ledge or, in the case of a character like (Melee) Falcon or Bowser, throw out a powerful/disjointed hitbox that'l outright defeat Rollout.

    Quote Originally Posted by Neosquid View Post
    I don't think entertainment value of a move should be completely ignored, though. Competitive viability obviously means something too but it's not the only thing that matters.
    Competitive moves can be made to look awesome. Awesome moves that're awesome because of gimmicks cannot be made t' be competitively viable.

    The competitive aspect of any fighting game is infinitely more important than pandering to the casuals since said casuals will play and enjoy the game regardless. The extra pandering isn't necessary to keep casuals happy, but balancing and other such competitivenesses is necessary to keep a competitive following happy.

    On that note, you're excluding the competitives from your point of view. Do ya think we want balance literally at the costs of aesthetics? Obviously not. Take M2K for example. He's been bloody obsessed with Mewtwo for years. In spite of this, he's never played 'em iin-tourney 'til the release of P:M. Why, ya ask? Because ya don't win tournaments as Mewtwo, he's a god-awful character. M2K would lose bags of money just for playin' his favorite character in-tournament, so he literally can't. Tournaments are his job and livelihood.

    As a competitive gamer, our character loyalty is challenged whenever said character ends up bein' poorly balanced and thus are right-shit. I stopped playin' Link in Brawl, my favorite character since Smash 64, because I was utterly sick of him bein' Hyrule-tier. It ain't fun bein' under a constant barrage of inescapable, likely-leading-to-a-0-death-gimp pressure. I didn't care that I could still use Link and consistently beat everyone I played with. He's such a bad character, it sucked the fun outta it for me. Imagine how all'a the Melee Falcon players felt come Brawl. Scar must'a been scarred for life.

    More importantly, your view on character viability's importance is skewed since ya play competitive Pokemon. Pokemon's banlists are decided by tier. Smash's banlists are not. Also, even the worst Pokemon can get a sweep when all of its team mates are dedicated to gettin' it said sweep. Link players don't have the luxury of switching to a higher tier character in the middle of a Brawl.

    Quote Originally Posted by Neosquid View Post
    Believe it or not, some people get more satisfaction from having fun in a match than they get from winning (like me). The game should try to appeal to competitive and casual players.
    Every time someone implies a competitive players' aim is just to win, I have the most assuredly illogical urge t' slap the shit outta them.

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  8. #2858
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    Quote Originally Posted by Splash_King View Post
    Every time someone implies a competitive players' aim is just to win, I have the most assuredly illogical urge t' slap the shit outta them.
    I second that
    And yeah I forgot the fact that they already showed Pika's special. Really wonder how well it'll work as a meteor mash.

  9. #2859
    The Scrubbiest of Hunters Splash_King's Avatar
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    waitwut

    Pikachu's Thunder is a meteor now? ... When did this happen?

    The Vermilion City Guru
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  10. #2860
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    I follow Sakurai on Miiverse. It's the pic of the day. That's why I said that I hope it wouldn't be too easy to evade, since Sakurai said:

    "Pikachu's Thunder now starts off with a thundercloud that deals a Meteor Smash! From left to right, you can see this combo starting with Pikachu throwing the opponent upward, Meteor Smashing with the lightning strike, and then directly attacking. Foes can dodge, of course, so the attack won't hit consistently, but when it does, it sure feels good!"

    > "So the attack won't hit consistently"

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