Official Baseball Talk

Big_League_Slugger · 05-28-2007, 02:33 AM

I went down to Miami to see the Marlins get swept by the Muts

Wiitime · 05-28-2007, 04:00 AM

that sucks. in aprl i went down to boston and say the Yanks lose, they ended up getting swept by boston.. i think or lost 2 out of 3.......... Yanks lost again... They will hopefully break out soon and win win win

Big_League_Slugger · 05-29-2007, 03:02 AM

The fish finally start hitting a beat the Cubs 5-3.

Big_League_Slugger · 05-29-2007, 03:14 AM

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2884986

Bonds might not give the Hall of Fame any memorabilia from his run at 756.

I hope he gets his head out his ass and gives to the hall.

jowii · 05-29-2007, 03:29 AM

i don't. i don't want the hall to have anything but an asterisk next to his name.

FWELR · 05-30-2007, 12:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jowii

i don't. i don't want the hall to have anything but an asterisk next to his name.

i agree, we should put an asterisk next to bonds' name.

but..... if we're doing that, then let's do this, too:
Put an asterisk next to Babe Ruth saying "He did not face any Negro League pitchers.

Put an asterisk next to Cy Young saying "He pitched on a higher mound than is used today."

Look, if you'll remember, Jason Grimsley got busted for using HGH last year. Had anybody else even heard of Jason Grimsley before that happened? If he's doing it, who the hell else isn't? Everybody cheats, at everything. If you don't believe me, don't lock your front door or you car tonight, because nobody will try to cheat and take your hard-earned stuff, right?

Big_League_Slugger · 05-30-2007, 03:24 PM

I was rooting for the your boyz last night FWELR.

I dislike the Muts.

I would think about taking Benitez off your hands. The Fish usually have a knack at rejuvenating a closers career ie: Armando Benitez, Todd Jones, Joe Borowski

jowii · 05-30-2007, 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FWELR

i agree, we should put an asterisk next to bonds' name.

but..... if we're doing that, then let's do this, too:
Put an asterisk next to Babe Ruth saying "He did not face any Negro League pitchers.

Put an asterisk next to Cy Young saying "He pitched on a higher mound than is used today."

Look, if you'll remember, Jason Grimsley got busted for using HGH last year. Had anybody else even heard of Jason Grimsley before that happened? If he's doing it, who the hell else isn't? Everybody cheats, at everything. If you don't believe me, don't lock your front door or you car tonight, because nobody will try to cheat and take your hard-earned stuff, right?

First off, I don't think that giving in to the "well everybody's doing it" idea is worth the pixels its printed on. If thats what makes you sleep easy at night as a giants fan, then so be it. But this how I feel about it. All of the other inequalities of baseball that you cited were all parts of the state of the game at the time (the rules, the field set up, etc) and not the state of human beings at the time. Thats why they are called "performance enhancing" drugs. They take what you could do on your own and amplify it to impossible levels. HGH (and I know this, as I have to take a medical licensing exam in about 3 weeks) is a natural hormone secreted into your blood stream in a tightly regulated manner. No amount of exercise and weight lifting can achieve the concentration levels achieved via an injection of it. Testosterone is the same way.
Changing the rules, the equipment, those are accepted changes. They change as the world does. No one disputes the greatness of those players. But when a player's greatness was achieved without his own natural strength, ability, and determination as the only things that he had, then that player is not part of the same category as Ruth and Young. They are part of a different category. A category of people, be they good or bad, that are unnaturally good at baseball. What makes the legends legends is the fact that they achieved great things by themselves; the way they were born. Thats what has inspired the young to the old for as long as the game has been around. That is what makes them great.

If want to enjoy an artificial performance sport go watch Nascar. At least they are honest about the machine's contribution to their success.

Samus101 · 05-30-2007, 05:20 PM

Even though I live in NH, the Yankees are my favorite team, and everyone HATES me for it.

FWELR · 05-30-2007, 11:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jowii

First off, I don't think that giving in to the "well everybody's doing it" idea is worth the pixels its printed on. If thats what makes you sleep easy at night as a giants fan, then so be it. But this how I feel about it. All of the other inequalities of baseball that you cited were all parts of the state of the game at the time (the rules, the field set up, etc) and not the state of human beings at the time. Thats why they are called "performance enhancing" drugs. They take what you could do on your own and amplify it to impossible levels. HGH (and I know this, as I have to take a medical licensing exam in about 3 weeks) is a natural hormone secreted into your blood stream in a tightly regulated manner. No amount of exercise and weight lifting can achieve the concentration levels achieved via an injection of it. Testosterone is the same way.
Changing the rules, the equipment, those are accepted changes. They change as the world does. No one disputes the greatness of those players. But when a player's greatness was achieved without his own natural strength, ability, and determination as the only things that he had, then that player is not part of the same category as Ruth and Young. They are part of a different category. A category of people, be they good or bad, that are unnaturally good at baseball. What makes the legends legends is the fact that they achieved great things by themselves; the way they were born. Thats what has inspired the young to the old for as long as the game has been around. That is what makes them great.

If want to enjoy an artificial performance sport go watch Nascar. At least they are honest about the machine's contribution to their success.

im not saying that what bonds did was right or wrong, ive said that before. what i was trying to say in that post was that you cannot put an asterisk next to bonds unless you put an asterisk next to just about every other single person because the rules change over time. back when everybody was doing these things, (yes i do believe bonds, mcguire, sosa, clemens, giambi, etc did performance enhancing drugs, and bonds was the only one who did not break the unwritten rule saying they wouldn't tell anyone. that's why he might get indicted and nobody else will.) there was no rule in baseball at the time saying that they couldn't do these things. the only law they broke is the federal law saying you cannot take these drugs without a perscription. so, therefore, you can't really fault bonds baseball-wise. you can do it otherwise, but denying his greatness (500 steals, 2000 RBIs, .300 hitter, 7 MVPS, 4 Gold Gloves, Silver Slugger, all-time walks leader [intentional and regular], all-time slugging percentage leader, all-time on-base percentage leader, and soon-to-be all-time home runs leader) is just flat-out insane.

and, lastly, there is no way i could watch 43 cars turn left 1000 times. no matter how fast they're going.

Big_League_Slugger · 05-31-2007, 06:36 AM

Fish sweep the Cubs. The crappy part for the Cubs was that they had a pre-game players only meeting and then lose 9-0.

ninja senses · 05-31-2007, 06:46 AM

baseball=borrrrrrrrrinnngg

Big_League_Slugger · 05-31-2007, 06:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ninja senses

baseball=borrrrrrrrrinnngg

Then don't go into a baseball thread. Loser

FWELR · 06-01-2007, 01:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ninja senses

baseball=borrrrrrrrrinnngg

n00b

if you're going to bash something, explain why you think its boring instead of just saying 2 words and leaving the thread forever, f***in n00b

Wiitime · 06-01-2007, 01:52 AM

Yanks won yesterday!!! They looked good!.. Now its time to sweep the red sox!!!

Big_League_Slugger · 06-01-2007, 02:53 AM

http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cg...PGP5Q5MDJ2.DTL

Good news for you FWELR. Benitez is coming home.

jowii · 06-01-2007, 02:54 AM

"looked good"...gimme a break. Aaron Hill stealing home on Petite looked good. A-Wrong shouting "Mine" to confuse the Jays into dropping in infield fly..that does not look good. for him, and the yankee's as a whole organization.

It seems that A-Rod is the barometer for desperation for the yanks. It happened during the 2004 ALCS when he tried to slap a ball out of Arroyo's glove as the yanks collapsed, and its happening now as they are flirting with last place. At least Jeter has some class.

And back to Bonds - yes I can fault him-baseball wise. He cheated. If he is the only one to come forward, then yes he should still be punished, and the others should be investigated and punished as well. Just because there isn't a law against something doesn't mean that its ethically right. And yes, I can and will deny Bonds' greatness, instantly starting at the time when this change began to happen:

from this:

to this:

Hence the asterisk.

And yeah I'm with ya with the Nascar. Turn right already.