Fried TV, My fault?

a30993

All right,

We used a Sanyo 27" TV for our Wii. It won't turn on anymore, we think it's fried.. Thing is, my DAD's blaming me for it, and it just so happened the night before a thunderstorm struck.

He says that me and my brother left the TV on all the time, when we have 2 others that are left on and we've had them a lot longer than the Wii one (about 9 or so years), and are fine to this day.

The thing is, a storm happened the last night, but the wii and TV are hooked up to the same power bar, and the Wii's fine. (To my knowledge, father hasn't let me hook it up to a seperate TV for fear of screwing THAT one up as well. -.- )

Anyway,

I'm asking your professional opinion.

Can leaving a TV on too much fry it?

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[DT]

Well use certainly reduces the life of the "wear" components (tubes, power supplies, bulbs/lights/projectors, etc.).

That seems like a reasonable assessment that the Wii on the same strip as the TV and still functioning likely means there wasn't lightening damage.

The TV might have just failed due to it's age and use (so unfortunately your Dad is indrectly correct). FWIW, we tend to leave our sets running all the time too, but just factor that in as part of the cost - we don't worry about using something as intended.

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austinAlan

Sometimes I wonder what the real difference is between a TV left own in wii's screen saver mode and a TV turned off. I believe that household electronics like TV's always suck some juice to be able to turn on quickly rather than warm up like they used to. If you didn't stick any screwdrivers in it and you were using the Wii's screensaver mode then to me the difference in wear and tear is possibly marginal.

KrisKhaos

I disagree with this, as I have retained lightning damage myself on about a half dozen items (mostly surge protectors ) and this sort of thing effects at random. Electricity will travel the shortest path and often appliances plugged in series (such as an outlet strip) complicate what is the shortest path, therefore can easily be skipped. Another element is that the TV also has another external connection, cable/satellite/antennae feed that more often than not is left ungrounded and unprotected as well as connected to the outside.

Good stuff DT, well said...

In addition to what DT said and depending on the frequency of use, powering a television on and off regularly generates more wear than simply just leaving it on in some circumstances. Think about public televisions for a moment, some these sets are on 12/24 hours a day and there is a number of these units are still running. Some of them are well over 10 to 20 years old.

So frankly ANY use generates wear, however the "charging" and "discharging" of compasitors, resistors, and diodes also generates (off/on) wear as well. (Most televisions I know of continue to retain charge in it's primary compasitors even when off for as long as the unit is plugged in. The idea is that it takes more power to charge them then it does to simply maintain them in attempts to save power and reduce wear.)

I wouldn't say not turning it off killed it, however simply using it did.

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a30993

Thank you, Kris.

Anyone else have any opinions? I'll take what I can get.

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Brawny

In short, you're dad's full of crap.

In long, he's kinda right lol.

Why do you leave them on in the first place....

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[DT]

Your disagreement is noted. It's is possible the TV got zinged and the VG didn't, but in my experience VG's and computers seem to always somehow throw themselves in the path of the incoming spike (maybe they're just heroic?)

Anyway...

Heck, this was a big oversight on my part, great catch.

I've seen a more than one TV setup where the owner took the time to buy a decent POWER surge protector, but left the cable/sat hooked up directly.

It's more likely to get zapped via your external signal connection than it is through the power supply (I saw an actually stat once).

If your surge protection lacks RG/coax type protection, you can go back to blaming it on the weather

__________________
"I want to be more like the ocean, no talking, all action"
- Jane's Addiction

"Ga-blaaaaagh!!"
- Liliane Eva

"The grammar corrections around here are officially old and tired."
- Celeste

Master Foot

Blame it on the rain...

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austinAlan

Chocolate Rain...
Came home one day and my TV failed to work
Chocolate Rain...
My Dad's pissed and I don't know what to say
Chocolate Rain... (breath)

LevesqueIsKing

Just because some things fry (even when multiple things are in the same outlet) and some don't, doesn't rule our the possibility of lightning damage.On multiple occasions I've had one thing at a time fry when I've got multiple things on the same powerbar.

The thunderstorm is obviously the most logical answer, it wasn't just a coincidence that your tv decided to die that night...

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a30993

You made my day, man.

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Michaelk

Beutiful Poem, no joke I loved it!

AceAlabama

my radio fried while i was reading this.

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dark samus

certain tvs have a certain amount of hours you can watch it for (hours its on) and frie after those hours have passed.

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a30993

He has a NEW argument against me.

He claims, that if it was lightning that killed the TV, then all of the things in the house would be fried, my computer, his computer, the Wii, my PS2, the other 2 TVs, everything electronic.

HALP.

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LevesqueIsKing

^Simply not true.

Logic>Dad

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austinAlan

Here's what you should do. Call every TV repair person in the phone book and start asking them questions. Tell them what you've said here. Say also that you are trying to figure out if this TV is worth fixing, ie is it possible that the repairs are cheap, etc... Ask them if lightning can fry just one item on a power stick.

Also look up your TV model on electronics repair forums. I recently order new amplifier chips for my TV when it lost its ability to synchronize the colors. I then had someone solder them into the TV for me because I didn't want to get electrocuted. (TV's have some dangerous capacitors in them that can hold a charge long after they have been unplugged)

You may never "win" against your Father but at least you will have learned something about it. You can feel satisfied about that and you might even find a cheap fix for it.

a30993

Well, I'll probably win over the fact that he won't let me hook up the Wii to another TV.. and I'm happy with that.

I keep saying

"You know dad, you've spent roughly 400$ on that Wii so far, it'd be a shame to just let it sit there...

Never to be used again...

My bro awfully likes to play Strikers.."


Just little pinpoints.

^^

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KrisKhaos

Again, electricity will take the shortest path to ground, and that path isn't always so obvious. Sure, a direct strike where the entire amount of power from the lightning in theory could blow every electronic device in the home no matter if it was protected or not, however this is very rarely the case due many unknown attributes. Lightning varies in the amount of electrical power however averages something along the lines of 1 billion volts and 100 kiloAmperes, well exceeding the home specifications of the amount of power it is capable of safely conducting, and most of us know that.

Keep in mind however that the electrical energy of lightning is generated by means of a static charge, and upon discharge like any power source relies on the ionic charges of atoms (except lightning is usually negatively charged) to pass it's charge from one point to another then neutralizing the given charge.

So while electrical wiring is a proven conductor, our low power conductive channels compared to the power of lightning is limiting to the point so often that majority of the power from a lightning strike is still discharged by that of which created the transfer of electricity in the first place. This means that power lines, data channels such as telephone/television cable, and even pipes often only see but a fraction of that power.

Most lightning based damage to home electronics is caused by the excess power spiking the existing power and traveling the lines to the nearest ground. Please keep in mind what lightning uses a grounding conductor is completely random, and it depends on the current ionic charge of the area and the passing cloud as the two are attempting to neutralize itself out. Even underground pipes are utilized as conductors and the reason why we are told NOT TO SHOWER DURING ELECTRICAL STORMS!

http://www.lightningsafety.com/nlsi_...s-2004-726.jpg
Lightning traveled along this underground metal pipe.

Something else to consider is that in some cases lightning damage through the power lines occurs when the lightning power spike disrupts the given flow of AC (alternating current) power to the point the electronic device is unable to compensate, therefore some items give while others do not, and this all depends on how much power when and where it flows along the given circuit.

For your dad to attempt to predict the effects of lightning damage is not only illogical, but a bit absurd. Lightning is way too unpredictable to where it is going to strike and what will be effected when it does. Modern technology might gives us some warning, as we are able to detect excessive ion charges that will help us proximate a given area of a potential strike (see Thor Guard), however to predict what will and won't be effected is impossible until after the strike has occurred. Everything from houses, trees, and even the most unusual devices are rendered into static electric conductors - as of current there is just no way to predict what will and what will not be effected. Higher rated surge protectors and lightning grounds help, however ANY outside connection capable of conducting electricity from data lines to water pipes are often forgotten.

http://www.lightningsafety.com/nlsi_...rod_damage.jpg
Lightning fishing rod damage - Top half of fishing pole hit by lightning. All resin has been vaporized and nothing is left but fiber that looks like cotton candy.

If the television failed during the passing of an electrical storm, especially if it went out right after a localized lightning strike, you can bet on the fact it was probably effected by lightning and not simply coencidence.

hahaha... I wouldn't call it "heroic" as much as I would call it subjective to ESD (Electro-Static Discharge). It's amusing how much power we generate walking around that we don't realize, as usually the only time we do is when we see or get that infamous static shock. Lightning works in the same fashioned however charges in a larger area. So even if a close strike near your home does not hit a power line or any other man-made electric circuit everything in your home (and including you) could have been utilized to store that static charge until enough was concentrated to complete the circuit and the lightning strike occurs, then everything holding that charge discharges. Since IC's (integrated circuits) are sensitive to static discharge, they appear heroic even if they wasn't hit in a more direct fashion. What is damaged and what isn't depends on how charged they was when they discharged and how much of a conductor they was utilized as by means of an "ionic channel". This is also why those struck or near a strike "feel the hairs on the back of there neck stand up" before a lightning strike takes place. Even when not hit, they still participated, and even those who didn't know it could have been part of the charge as well.

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[DT]

Holy Smokes! +1

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"I want to be more like the ocean, no talking, all action"
- Jane's Addiction

"Ga-blaaaaagh!!"
- Liliane Eva

"The grammar corrections around here are officially old and tired."
- Celeste